Age of sigmar

[lilscutt]

Fritz read the rules of the war scrolls, most of them are amazing and really cool, yes I understand you want rank and file and be able to hammer math it out, but guess what There are rules for taking massive amounts of models in unit. I think you read to much on the Internet!!! Lol I'm only defending it because I played couple of games with starter set and its fun. Now as of point system, your telling me between you and a oppenent you can't make fair and fun without points? Sounds like we become dependent upon it. Also think of this as a company, the sales for fantasy was 15 percent of the total pie!!!That's less then hobby supplies. Fantasy needed a remake and it got it in this form. I think it is awesome( but I know this is ruining childhood of dreams with age of sigmar) 1st time ever the story well progress as new models well come out, campaigns you can follow, and you will have bonus for take fotmatioms( yes like 40k) it's popular why not make money on it. Also first time ever be able to play a fantasy game for avg person in hour n half. I think most people well enjoy the game, but like I said as a business change was needed and now that GW owns all the rights to age of sigmar, they can do some amazing things as a model company. But to be mad over no points is kinda far out there.

[ahrimen]

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[Fritz]

Reading the warscrolls is what elicited this response. Call it "math hammer" all you want. Blame it on the evil internet all you want. I've ignored it and made my own opinion based on the rulesheet and the full warscrolls that your brother some how got a day early thanks to an oopsie on GW's website. The evil internet that GW refuses to use for PR because there are mean people out there that dare to criticize them has nothing to do with why Age of Sigmar is a cruel joke. Leaving balance up to players is a lazy cop out. It feels like GW was just too lazy to balance a game, so they said "fuck it." The basic tenet of any game is competitive balance. It's like soccer players being asked to be perfectly OK with one team having 18 players on the field while the other team has 9. We're not talking about the nitpicking of individual units that is open to personal opinion. They literally didn't even try here.

The worst part is I actually LOVE the fact they progressed the story. I like all the story that's been leaked. The game itself, however, is horrible. You made a 40k/warmahordes hybrid that will attract players from neither game and kicked all existing fantasy players in the junk. I've defended GW on countless occasions. I'm done.

No one is asking GW to be monks here and make an unprofitable game. The fact is, however, that fantasy sales have tanked thanks to massive mismanagement. Over the last decade, GW took a successful game and destroyed it. That's the truth.

[lilscutt]

I've seen that Dan, that is funny. Very fair fritz, everyone has there opinion.

[ahrimen]

Honestly as a quick and easy skirmish game it's fine, it's just not a replacement, I think lack or points is a stupid idea, it's like saying " brakes don't work 100% of the time the way they should so we are removing them entirely!" The reason fantasy was failing was as Fritz said "mismanagement " when I started playing. You could literally get a whole army in a box for $25 (Adjust for inflation call it $60 in today's money) and that box had 60+ models in the box. Fantasy was the big seller at the Towson store also! They literally priced people out of fantasy. It was to expensive for new players and old players don't buy as much stuff when the prices are so over the top. Especially when other companies started making models that were comparable in quality and lower in price. (Mantic)

[ahrimen]

So in looking at the rules a little closer I see that it hurt low quality high number armies to a terrible degree. The battle shock and instant win rules mean that either A) yu go to war with nothing soft and keep your numbers low. Or B) if your going to outnumber your opponent then put everything you have on the table and hold nothing back. Kinda stupid/

[lilscutt]

the game has some awesome rules that make it fun, also with more to come as in campaign and narrative story to come down the line, the game will be good with awesome models. Playing actually games are different from 8th BECAUSE ITS A DIFFERENT GAME. But the no point system allows you and the person to make a verbal agreement on what to take. Does that mean you have to actually talk to him on what yall going to play. For example he bob lets play game game of aos...ok you wanna play 3 characters 2 monsters and 5 troops and war machine. Sure, now you take at with in that. It's all about the warscrolls band there rules now and it makes it fun.

[Berserker]

Sorry, after reading the rules I have no interest in this game. I'll stick with 8th for a while, unless gw decides that they won't support it any longer

[Fritz]

Look, it's a different game yes, but it also plays way too much like 40k. Everything that made Warhammer distinct from 40k is gone. I already play 40k, so there is no reason to use different miniatures to play the same game. When I play with the fantasy, I want a different game.

And please stop telling us to just agree to some kind of limitations on our own. It was pure lazy game design not to make a real balancing system. I shouldn't have to come to agreements with other players before every game on something that basic. Even when you're doing that, you're ballparking it at best.

[lilscutt]

And please stop telling us to just agree to some kind of limitations on our own. It was pure lazy game design not to make a real balancing system. I shouldn't have to come to agreements with other players.

You make agreements every time you play, doesn't matter what system you play, that flames of war ,40k ,8th edition, age of sigmar, king of war( whatever that horrible knock off is of GW game) Star Wars armada. In any of those game you take things that op no one going to play you. This game now gives you options, rules give an added flavor that was from back in day from rogue trader.... Shocker there use to be no point system. A 2000 point 8th edition fantasy with malekith, or nagash vs goblin is unbalanced but legal. Arachon everchoosen and legion vs just tomb king unbalanced, but legal. Any list from the khaine book vs anything unbalanced but legal. Lizard men skink cloud with slan, vs dwarfs unbalanced but legal. Your agruement isn't about balance, your argument is the game has changed a lot from something you had growing up to something your not used too. Also it's to simplistic and no rank and file. Those are your agreements not of balance because 8th wasn't balance even with the point system.

It's amazing we complain for change and a company listen, and they give you change but when the change is like no no no we wanted some of that but not that, we will change games...... Just fathoms me sometimes..

Side note tho, I still have fun playing both and continue to do so.

[Fritz]

No no no. You don't get to claim GW listened. They most certainly did not. Progression of a storyline is one thing. A great many people wanted that, myself included. I am, in fact, genuinely interested in how they delevop this story. As much teasing as everyone is doing over the "Sigmar Space Marines," I like the models. However, the core rules are not what anyone wanted. Scrapping everything that made Warhammer what it was is not something anyone wanted. If you want listening, go have a look at the changes in Kings of War from first edition to the coming second edition. That's what listening to your customers looks like.

I said "on something this basic" when it came to agreements. I may have edited that line in while you were typing your reply. I want to be able to come to a hobby shop, say "I have X point lists" and start rolling into the game. I don't want to negotiate something as basic as my army composition.

Giving examples of imbalance from within GW's system is a terrible example since GW's reputation for balance is notoriously bad. Instead of attempting to improve, they said fuck it. This isn't an attachment thing (you lost those people between the 7th and 8th huge changes). I actually grew up on 40k and BFG (also abandoned by GW) for the record. This is because GW made a poor product that plays like one of their other products while also betraying the trust of their customers.

[Fritz]

To turn the conversation a little more positive, I am sincerely digging the Sigmarite models. I am tempted to use them as a basilean Kings of War army. The foot troops would make good Paladins, the winged troops are perfect elohi, and I can use my high elf pheonix model as part of the same army.

[lilscutt]

Yes the models are pretty awesome, I agree

[Nighean Donn]

I can't believe I'm posting about this.............. the end must be near.

I just happened to catch Brien Dulaney's facebook post regarding this, and saw he posted about Total War: Warhammer in his last comment. Sounded like it was something to do with the old story and game.

This was his mentioned link to the game's facebook page (for those of you on fb):
https://www.facebook.com/WarhammerTotal ... cation=ufi

Article:
http://www.gamewatcher.com/news/2015-26 ... ical-games

And here is the developers website (though it's in another language):
http://www.elementsgaming.com/category/ ... warhammer/

This is all I've heard about the last 2 days... so ya.

[Nighean Donn]

Oh nm. I just noticed this was video gaming, i think. sorry.... please ignore.