damn good point

[ahrimen]

"The other day I was reading Newsweek magazine
and came across some poll
data I found rather hard to believe. It must be
true given the source,
right?

The Newsweek poll alleges that 67 percent of
Americans are unhappy with
the direction the country is headed and 69
percent of the country is
unhappy with the performance of the president.
In essence 2/3s of the
citizenry just ain't happy and want a change.

So being the knuckle dragger I am, I started thinking, ''What we are so
unhappy about?''

Is it that we have electricity and running water
24 hours a day, 7 days
a week? Is our unhappiness the result of having
air conditioning in the
summer and heating in the winter? Could it be
that 95.4 percent of these unhappy folks have a job? Maybe it is the
ability to! walk into a grocery
store at any time and see more food in moments
than Darfur has seen in
the last year?

Maybe it is the ability to drive from the
Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic
Ocean without having to present identification
papers as we move through
each state? Or possibly the hundreds of clean
and safe motels we would
find along the way that can provide temporary
shelter?

I guess having thousands of restaurants with
varying cuisine from around
the world is just not good enough. Or could it
be that when we wreck our
car, emergency workers show up and provide
services to help all and even
send a helicopter to take you to the hospital.

Perhaps you are one of the 70 percent of
Americans who own a home. You
may be upset with knowing that in the
unfortunate case of a fire, a
group of trained firefighters will appear in
moments and use top notch
equipment to extinguish the flames thus saving
you, your family and your
belogingings.

Or if, while at home watching one of your many
flat scr een TVs, a
burglar or prowler intrudes, an officer equipped
with a gun and a
bullet-proof vest will come to defend you and
your family against attack
or loss. This all in the backdrop of a
neighborhood free of bombs or
militias raping and pillaging the residents.
Neighborhoods where 90
percent of teenagers own cell phones and
computers.
> >>>
How about the complete religious, social and
political freedoms we enjoy
that are the envy of everyone in the world?
Maybe that is what has 67
percent of you folks unhappy.
> >>>
Fact is, we are the largest group of ungrateful,
spoiled brats the world
has ever seen. No wonder the world loves the
U.S., yet has a great
disdain for its citizens. They see us for what
we are. The most blessed
people in the world who do nothing but complain
about what we don't
have, and what we hate about the country instead
of thanking the good
Lord we live here.
> >>>
I know, I know. What about the president who
took u! s into war and has noplan to get us out? The president who has a
measly 31 percent approval rating? Is this the same president who guided
the nation in the dark
days after 9/11? The president that cut taxes to
bring an economy out of
recession? Could this be the same guy who has
been called every name in
the book for succeeding in keeping all the
spoiled ungrateful brats safe from terrorist attacks?
> >>>
The commander in chief of an all-volunteer army
that is out there
defending you and me? Did you hear how bad the
President is on the news
or talk show? Did this news affect you so much,
make you so unhappy you
couldn't take a look around for yourself and see
all the good things and be glad?
> >>>
Think about it......are you upset at the
President because he actually
caused you personal pain OR is it because the
"Media" told you he was
failing to kiss your sorry ungrateful behind
every day.
> >>>
Make no mistake about it. The troops i! n Iraq
and Afghanistan have
volunteered to serve, and in many cases may have
died for your freedom.
There is currently no draft in this country.
They didn't have to go.
> >>>
They are able to refuse to go and end up with
either a ''general''
discharge, an ''other than honorable'' discharge
or, worst case
scenario, a ''dishonorable'' discharge after a
few days in the brig.
> >>>
So why then the flat-out discontentment in the
minds of 69 percent of
Americans? Say what you want but I blame it on
the media. If it bleeds
it leads and they specialize in bad news.
Everybody will watch a car
crash with blood and guts. How many will watch
kids selling lemonade at
the corner? The media knows this and media
outlets are for-profit
corporations. They offer what sells, and when
criticized, try to defend
their actions by "justifying" them in one way or
another. Just ask why
they tried to allow a murderer like O.J. Simpson
to write a book about
how he didn't kill his wife, but if he did he
would have done it this
way..! ....Insane!
> >>>
Stop buying the negativism you are fed everyday
by the media. Shut off
the TV, burn Newsweek, and use the New York
Times for the bottom of your
bird cage. Then start being grateful for all we
have as a country. There
is exponentially more good than bad.
> >>>
We are among the most blessed people on Earth
and should thank God
several times a day, or at least be thankful and
appreciative."
> >>>
"With hurricanes, tornados, fires out of
control, mud slides, flooding,
severe thunderstorms tearing up the country from
one end to another, and
with the threat of bird flu and terrorist
attacks, "Are we sure this is
a good time to take God out of the Pledge of
Allegiance?"

[boagrius]

you don't post much but when you do it's good!

[ahrimen]

i actualy didnt write this. i found it and agreed 100% and thought it needed new forum.

[Clan ONeill Guy]

I never, ever wonder why I'm a Galatian! Great post, Dan. I agree 100% too.

[lilkender]

My ex sent me this from Afghanistan (with a different ending). I had to write him back to call "Bullshit". I don't know who wrote this mound of shit but I would like to smack the author. Why does he think we should be happy with what we have when we could have better? He makes it sound like life is perfect in the U.S. but we still have murder, rape and starving children. This is not the time to sit back and 'be thankful for what we have,' we need to keep working to improve this country. We should NOT be content with mediocrity. Sure, we're ahead of the third world countries he compares us to, but as first-world countries go the USA is not at the top of the list. Canada and Sweden have much better health-care systems. Many countries are safer and cleaner.

In case you weren't keeping track, the president has not kept citizens safe from terrorist attacks. Have you forgotten 9/11 so quickly? Anybody could have "guided the nation" as well as he did and we are still IN a recession. And we do not have "complete religious, social and political freedoms". We have political corruption and politicians who want to control citizens in the name of "protection". We have prejudice and the removal of civil rights, by the government. The "complete religious, social and political freedoms we enjoy" are there in name only. In South Africa, gays have civil rights. Here, churches give civil rights (still not to gays). Religion is so tied up with our government that not being Christian is "anti-American". They seem to have forgotten about the Separation of Church and State.

Don't turn off your tv or throw away your paper and live in blissful ignorance. Closing your eyes to problems will not fix them. Stay informed! Yes, everything from the media has a spin on it, and everyone has an agenda - read it with that in mind. For a more impartial view, read foreign papers like http://www.independent.co.uk/ or http://www.hindustantimes.com

The reason 2/3 of the country now disapprove of Bush is that he's using the country's resources and its volunteer military's lives to line his and his buddies' pockets rather than doing what's best for the country. He's going against his top military officials' advice. The rampant idiocy in this administration is utterly mind-boggling.

I appreciate what the troops have "done for me" and I thank them for their service. I can agree many people in the U.S. are ungrateful and spoiled brats. But I won't fall for this flag-waving propagandistic crap.

Sorry this is so long but this stuff pisses me off.

[ahrimen]

the point is that the new yourk times and other "main stream media" have a major left wing agenda and try to mask it behind "the truth" when in fact its !/2 truths at best straght out lies at most. and yes we have murder, rape, gangs and all that and we should do all we can to elimate it (clan o'niel guy knows all about that as hes a law enforcment officer) the problem is perspective. we should always strive for better but be thankful for what we have and not to whine about things that are actualy better here than any where else. and to blame bush for things like gas prices or the war, you might as well blame micky mouse cause he has as much to do with it.

we have been at war with radical islam since the 70's just because it was a 1 sided fight ( they attack us and we do nothing) makes it no less a war. as far as 3000 casualtys go, we lost 91,000 fighting japan alone another 75,000 on the europian front. the russians lost in the millions, mebe if some one had the curage and forsight to do somthing about hitler when he broke the first few leage of nation resolutions like not alowing germany to have a military over 200,000 or no tanks and attack air craft, or no battle ships over a certain tonnage. if mebe some would have done somthing then mebe 6 million jews and 28 million other people would be alive at he cost of a few thousand........but no in normal idiotic american fasion we have to wait until a homicidal maniac conqurs a continent be for the people of this contry will approve force. i guess we should have waited until sadam actualy got the sanctions lifted (oil for food look it up) got the nukes from libia (you know the ones just after the invasion that momar handed over cause the paper trail in iraq led to him.) and put a stragle hold over the whole middle east. the instad of 3000 in 6 yeas we could do 91,000 in 3 years all over again would that be better?

[MorGrendel]

Ohh, Jeffy needs popcorn! Doug get the fireworks.

I will limit my comments to; you (and this is all whiny americans and not lilkinder) can be unhappy with the direction America is going despite the many great freedoms we are afforded. Be unhappy, its your privilidge, but do me a favor and right write a congressman. I'm sure when he is in his office one of the 60 days in a year, he might look at it and do something eventually (its not like he will be voted out anytime soon). However, finger pointing at the president for all of our problems is misdirected, as he is probably the least corrupt of all the scum bags in Washington.


For lilkender, I was with you until church and state. This is one of the most misunderstood/misconstruded concepts in politcs. On the quick, if Thomas Jefferson, the coiner of the term, had wanted a secular state, he would have wrote it in the consitution. Rather in the Baptist (sp) Papers he explains the first Admendment and defends the idea that goverment should not create religions and force its peoples to conform to them. (see English Protestantism)

[lilkender]

I definitely agree with you that whiny, ungrateful, spoiled Americans should STFU.

But the U.S. is trying to be the world's police force, and we don't have the money or manpower to do it all. U.S. forces will not keep the backing of our allies and the UN if they keep doing things like, oh, violating the Geneva Convention. "At war with radical Islam"? You make it sound like we're on another Crusade.

I'm not complaining about gas/oil prices. I'm surprised they stayed as low as they did for as long as they did. But that is what led researchers to slack off about finding alternate fuels. Heck, we still have untapped oil sources in the U.S.

Morg - The government may not have created a religion but it does expect people to conform to religious-based laws, whether federally or state-made. They want to outlaw gay unions and abortion because they're sinful, not because they're inherently unethical. Scientific research is carried out in other first-world countries that wouldn't be funded here or is outright illegal. It's no wonder other countries see us as backwards rednecks. I think "religious freedom" should include "freedom to not be religious".

As for blaming the President, no, I blame his entire administration, and he's at the top of it. The leader ultimately has to be held responsible.

[ahrimen]

to my knolage we never broke the geneva conventions that applies to "uniformed combatants" what we are up againt is a force of sabatures and terrorist who spit on the convention by diberatly attackin or using as human shiels inocent civillians, in the conventions ununiformed sabaturs are offered no protection and may be by the rules of war exicuted apun capture. id be all for using the convention if alquida, hezzbola, hammas and all the othe wackos would pic a uniform, but they choose the wear civilan clothes and target civians so fuck'um!

id put underpants on the heads of the entire population of iraq and not lose 1 minute of sleep. (underpants on head is not torture)

oh,and if you think the media isnt bias. how many stories about pvt. lindy and abu grab (underpants on head is not torture) but who can tell me the names of the 2 service men who won the medal of honor, and how many stories did you hear?

[Kaliban]

have to call bullshit on some of this ...

one the world comes runnign to us everytime there is a problem .. oh we need money lets ask the americans ..

we need military help oh lets ask the us ..

when the world needs something they come to us .. hell why do we not pull all the aid from some of these countries an see how far they get ..

we could use all that money that other countries want from us to use for ourselves to make things better here

as for our allies .. there is a bunch of ungratefull SOB's most of them would be speaking german or jap if it wasnt for us getting involved because at the time we were playing by the isolationism rules an keeping to ourselves .


So yea go ahead an blame THe pres for what going on .. our military would be in a better place if it wasnt for some man named Clinton ..

I do not like to discuss politics but sometimes i have to call BS when i see it .. the media is so freakin bias its pitiful .. a guy i work with who is a vet of this recent cinflict even stated that CNN is called the comunist network ..

and like Ahrimen said where are the news stories of the MOH awards or other stories of valor .. YOU DO NOT HERE IT !!!!!!

[ahrimen]

and as for cananda.....

thier socalized health care system is actualy on the verge of collapse there is a 2 year waiting list for the most simple prosedure and thousands of cananadians come to the us to get treatment they cant get in thier home country (i worked at hopkins for a year i saw first hand) i guess if mexico became a leader in medical treatment we could socalize our system and send our sick down there....... but i dont see that happening. could our health care system be better? hells yea! but think of all the things that gov. runs. keep thinking, ok now imagine they run the health care..................aaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!! they cant even manage the mva! and you want to put them in charge of my health, NO THANKS!

its easy to keep your country clean when you have 150% our land mass and 10 % our population.

[Fritz]

As most of you might guess I have some serious issues with the author of Dan's original post. I usually keep quiet since most of you don't care and I get quite tired of being mocked and isolated. However, I didn't think it was fair to leave lilkender out there on his own. I'll try and keep it as civil as possible and take this point by point.

"The other day I was reading Newsweek magazine and came across some poll data I found rather hard to believe. It must be true given the source, right?

The Newsweek poll alleges that 67 percent of Americans are unhappy with the direction the country is headed and 69 percent of the country is
unhappy with the performance of the president. In essence 2/3s of the
citizenry just ain't happy and want a change.

The author seems to insinuate that this maybe a false statement. To set the record straight Newsweek is hardly the only one who has found the president's approval rating to substantially sub-par. Even a FOX news poll from mid-May put his approval rating at 34%

So being the knuckle dragger I am, I started thinking, ''What we are so unhappy about?''

Is it that we have electricity and running water 24 hours a day, 7 days a week? Is our unhappiness the result of having air conditioning in the
summer and heating in the winter? Could it be that 95.4 percent of these unhappy folks have a job? Maybe it is the ability to! walk into a grocery
store at any time and see more food in moments than Darfur has seen in
the last year? Maybe it is the ability to drive from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic Ocean without having to present identification papers as we move through each state? Or possibly the hundreds of clean and safe motels we would find along the way that can provide temporary shelter?

I guess having thousands of restaurants with varying cuisine from around
the world is just not good enough. Or could it be that when we wreck our
car, emergency workers show up and provide services to help all and even send a helicopter to take you to the hospital.

Perhaps you are one of the 70 percent of Americans who own a home. You may be upset with knowing that in the unfortunate case of a fire, a
group of trained firefighters will appear in moments and use top notch
equipment to extinguish the flames thus saving you, your family and your
belogingings.

Or if, while at home watching one of your many flat screen TVs, a burglar or prowler intrudes, an officer equipped with a gun and a bullet-proof vest will come to defend you and your family against attack or loss. This all in the backdrop of a neighborhood free of bombs or militias raping and pillaging the residents. Neighborhoods where 90 percent of teenagers own cell phones and computers.

These would be some excellent points, except that they are blatant hyperbole. Every person I have had the pleasure to know either as a friend, family member, co-worker or acquaintance has in one way shape or form understood how lucky they are to be an American. To debase political dissatisfaction into such a ridiculous caricature is unhealthy for open and honest debate. Just because most Americans have it comparatively well means that we can't yearn for something better? That is not what this country is about.

As a side point, I find it disgusting that this obviously right-wing commentator has the nerve to bring up Darfur. Left-wing action groups are amongst the loudest voices trying to get something done about the on-going genocide in that region and have far exceeded anything coming from the right.

How about the complete religious, social and political freedoms we enjoy that are the envy of everyone in the world? Maybe that is what has 67 percent of you folks unhappy.

I hardly consider our religious and political systems totally free. For politics we have choice A and choice B and frankly, I hate both choices. It's like having to choose between moldy cheese and rotten apples. Sure I get to choose, but I get sick both ways. As for religion, the advent of the religious right has made things extremely tense. I know quite a few people who have questioned their faith because of what Christian "fundamentalists" are espousing. Muslims especially are in an incredibly awkward position. Just because a few lunatics have hijacked their religion to do unspeakable evil, they are regarded as terrorists by many Americans. That's like identifying all Christians by the beliefs of the afore mentioned Christian fundamentalists. Anyone remember the big deal that was made over the representative that wanted to be sworn in on the Qur'an?

This all said, I would not trade our system for any other. Yes, it has its flaws, but it is by far the best, most stable system around. Our political problems are based around the fact that so many Americans do have good lives. We are by and large complacent, and therefore are content with the simple A and B choice. Our religious problems are nothing compared to how Europe is dealing with Muslims (banning head scarves, banning Muslim religious schools, etc). I really want to emphasize this point. I firmly believe that our system is the best around, and I would not trade it for any other. That said, there are some improvements that could be made. Like everything human, it has flaws. This is exactly what the original author seems incapable of understanding. I am simultaneously happy and thankful to be an American and yet dissatisfied with how politics are currently going.

Fact is, we are the largest group of ungrateful, spoiled brats the world has ever seen. No wonder the world loves the U.S., yet has a great disdain for its citizens. They see us for what we are. The most blessed people in the world who do nothing but complain about what we don't have, and what we hate about the country instead of thanking the good Lord we live here.

I sure hope the author doesn't have a "Proud to be American" bumper sticker since it would be such a hypocritical notion. When 71% of the population embarrasses you, as is clearly the case, I don't see what he has to be proud of. Also, he has his notions about the rest of the world mixed up. The world currently has a great disdain for the U.S., especially our president, but is more accepting of its citizens so long as they aren't the "ugly American" (the tourist that doesn't speak a lick of the native language, is disrespectful of the native culture, and expects everyone speaks English).

I know, I know. What about the president who took u! s into war and has no plan to get us out? The president who has a measly 31 percent approval rating? Is this the same president who guided the nation in the dark days after 9/11? The president that cut taxes to bring an economy out of recession? Could this be the same guy who has been called every name in the book for succeeding in keeping all the spoiled ungrateful brats safe from terrorist attacks?
> >>>
The commander in chief of an all-volunteer army that is out there defending you and me? Did you hear how bad the President is on the news
or talk show? Did this news affect you so much, make you so unhappy you couldn't take a look around for yourself and see all the good things and be glad?
> >>>
Think about it......are you upset at the President because he actually
caused you personal pain OR is it because the "Media" told you he was
failing to kiss your sorry ungrateful behind every day.
> >>>
Make no mistake about it. The troops in Iraq and Afghanistan have
volunteered to serve, and in many cases may have died for your freedom.
There is currently no draft in this country. They didn't have to go.
> >>>
They are able to refuse to go and end up with either a ''general'' discharge, an ''other than honorable'' discharge or, worst case scenario, a ''dishonorable'' discharge after a few days in the brig.
> >>>

I've got a news flash for this guy, the economy is still in recession. The number of jobs may supposedly be going up, but the economy has yet to recover from the pitfall it took when Bush first came into office. Not to mention that these new jobs are paying significantly less that the ones that have disappeared. It would be ridiculous to blame Bush for the economy tanking when he got into office. The economy often has a mind of its own and there isn't much that the government, much less the president directly, can do about it. But to credit him with bringing the country out of the same recession is equally ridiculous, especially since the economy is clearly not strong.

Once again, the author also debases the debate into irrational hyperbole. "Or is it because the "Media" told you he was failing to kiss your sorry ungrateful behind every day." Give me a break. I try my absolute best to diversity where I get my information. I watch the Daily Show, Colbert, and occasionally CNN and even FOX. I honestly prefer the print media more than the cable networks. Even in that regard, I try to diversity, mainly by using google news. For those of you that have never used it, google news links you to thousands of newspapers across the world. I've been linked to everyone from the New York Times to the India Times to The Guardian (a right wing British paper). Add to that everything that comes out of Dan's mouth (which should be regarded as a network in and of itself =D). To say that my dissatisfaction for Bush is informed simply by "what the media told me" is insulting, especially since I've demonstrated my willingness to at least listen to the other side where the author obviously has not.

My disappointment in Bush does not come from Iraq directly. It comes from the general atmosphere of incompetence that permeates from his administration. He supports a Secretary of Defense that bases his strategy for war off a notion that "they will greet us as liberators" and disregards the advise of key generals and intelligence reports. This is the same secretary that all but tells the troops to get bent when they ask for more body armor. The testimony of the Attorney General before Congress was even more astounding. Either Gonzales is the most incompetent forgetful lawyer in the history of lawyers, or he was straight up lying through his teeth. Either is totally unacceptable for a man that is supposed to be running this country's legal system.

What is most disturbing to me is that this administration has made it abundantly clear that it values loyalty to a certain political creed above actual ability, even in positions where it should be irrelevant. This is certainly true of all administrations, but this one takes it to a new extreme. Why have a lawyer who pursues justice for its own sake when we can have someone who went to a religious based right-wing law school? Nevermind they won't prosecute corrupt Republicans or that their actually grasp of the law is weak at best. There are certain parts of the bureaucracy that should not be politicized. Yet this administration has repeatedly attempted to do just that. The plain facts are that this president is not out for what is best for the vast majority of Americans. The two cities hit by the 9/11 attacks, Washington DC and New York, voted overwhelmingly against Bush in the 2004 election. In response, he substantially cut their funding through the Department of Homeland Security. The Statue of Liberty and the Empire State Building were not even considered landmarks.


Alright, that's all I feel up to writing tonight. I'll finish the rest some other time. This rant brought to you by insomnia.

Edit: FEAR MY WALL OF TEXT

[Titus]

SFC Paul Smith of the US Army
CPL Jason Dunham of the US Marines

[hypo]

wow I started to post something yesterday and then got distracted now this has all blown up. Um one point that I would like to make is that you should never just THROW away media, you should always question it. just because you don't share the same view doesn't mean that you know the whole story or not. If you just trun a blind eye to things you don't like you are just as bad as the people complaining about things they don't know anything about. I will try and leave it at this, I haven't seen it yet, but if you all start to attack one another this post is dead. If one person doesn't it your comments will be deleted. Lets keep it clean. :D

[ahrimen]

huzzah! titus, but i knew you would know i wouldn't doubt clan o'niel guy would know either, but so few people i ask that Question to can answer it. actualy your the first. but i usualy pose the question to libs who spout off about how abc, cnn, nbc, abc, pmsnbc, and the newyork times are fair and balanced news sources.

did you learn about them on the news or the history channel?, i heard about them on the history channel. i guess you may have heard their stories on the armed forces network, but thoes 2 stories and all the other stories of courage and valor should be played every day on all networks. in stead we get 1000 different stories how a few soldiers put underpants on the heads of men who would without a second thought kill me and my son and rape my wife to death in the name of allah. im supose to feel sorry for them cause they got briefs ont thier head........FUCK'EM

to eveyone in america, if you ever hear a mullah talk about death to infidels on islamic lands, look in the mirror, thats the infidel, look down, thats islamic lands. make no mistake about it, certain branches of islam want total global domination under the 12th emon. iv watched the recruitment vidios on utube in english and thats what they say from their own mouth.